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Cigarettes and chit-chat with Kevin Devine -- 11.30.08
by Matt Keith on 2008-12-28 |
Firstly, how's working with Procrastinate! Music going?
Kevin: That was great. I mean, I think it was just a one-off thing. Just because I don't really know--those guys are some of my closest friends in music, and Jess is one of my closest friends period. But, it's not like a "record label" record label. It's sort of, like, whenever they really want to do something they'll do it. And they really helped me out with that record, and I don't even know if there's plans for them to do another record from anyone at this point. They just kind of, like they do with a lot of things, they just kind of do something when it moves them to do it.
Which makes sense with the label's name, actually.
Kevin: And with their band. But, I'm super-grateful and thrilled with how getting that record re-released worked. It was really great for me, and we'll see how it goes. I might do something else with them at some point, but it's not like a label where you have a contract or something like that. Just, like, a one-off.
How was the New York show with Jesse and Brian?
Kevin: That was awesome. Because we did that tour this summer, and then we hadn't played together like that since. So it was really nice. It sort of found it's rhythm quick. We play on each other's sets the whole time. So, there was a lot of nerves because we hadn't done it in three-and-a-half months, and there was about six-hundred people coming to that show. It sold out really quickly, so we were kinda like "I hope we still know what the fuck we're doing" 'cause there's going to be people here. But, we did. It turned out really well. Home-town, beautiful venue and it was great. It was fun.
If I looked on your ipod right now, what would be the most played album?
Kevin: You know what's really embarrassing? I'm finding out, the more I'm around people who are way more musically-voracious than I am, that I learn about music through osmosis. Like, if someone else is playing something I'm like "Oh, what is that?". I listen to the same fucking fifteen things over and over again. You'd probably find, like, yesterday in the van I listened to "Harvest" by Neil Young for the two-hundredth-and-fifteenth-thousandth time. I'm trying to think--Brian's record's great. Brian Bonz is really good, I listen to his stuff. I listen to the Jealous Girlfriends from New York. This guy called Abe Bondi who's a killer singer/song-writer from Palenville, New York upstate. Uhm, I listen to the Colour Revolt record a lot--the last one they put out, "Plunder, Beg, and Curse". I think right now that's probably what you'd find. I liked the Conner Obrest record, I thought that was cool. I liked it. But then, there's a lot of old stuff--well, not old, but established stuff. Built to Spill, Modest Mouse, Elliot Smith, Bob Dylan, Hank Williams, Johnny Cash, R.E.M., Nirvana. I've listened to "In Utero" all the time lately. It's like I hear it through different ears every time I listen to it. I'm like, "Oh, right, this record is so sick."
Any good stories from the road to share?
Kevin: In general? I mean, the good and the bad thing about touring a lot is that a lot of this stuff sort of collapses in on itself and the stories become one long thing. I saw a woman today at the in-store we played and she was like, "Oh, I saw you play at Top Cats in 2006." Now, that was more than two-and-a-half years ago, but I've been on tour since I did that show. That was the beginning of what's been about three years of touring. So, to me, that meeting with that woman both feels like it happened twenty-five years ago and yesterday, if it could possibly be both. So, there's tons of stories everyday, especially when you're traveling around with funny people funny things happen. But, it's more about tics or behavioral things people do that would be hard to translate in a story that you'd see and be like, "Oh, that's what he's talking about!" But, uhm, last night we were outside the Rocket Town in Nasvhille and Len from Colour Revolt was up for the show. And he was like, "Have you ever heard this Norma Jean song?!" and then he put on this really crazy hardcore song that Aaron from Mewithoutyou sings on, and we're sitting in his car listening to it on his computer. Then I look at the window of the car and Mike, the merch guy, is climbing up this huge chain-link fence beside us. He just gets to the top, looks around and climbs back down. Then we think it's a cop pulling up to stop him, but it's a street-sweeper, and he followed the hardcore song with that song Del Amitri--do you remember that song? It's like, "Look around the world, pretty baby, is it everything you--"
I know exactly what you're talking about.
Kevin: Yeh, terrible pop-song. These are really funny moments to me. Driving around getting lost at two in the morning, in Nasvhille, trying to find an apartment to go to some party when you don't even know the people throwing the party. Then realizing it half-way through and turning around. Breaking into my friend's apartment last night through a window, because he was out of town and said I could stay at his place, but didn't leave a key. So, I jimmied open a window and literally climbed up half his house, shimmied my way through, and opened the door from inside. That's the stuff I think is sick. I used to have a lot more, "I got so fucked up, and I woke up in someone's apartment that I'd never met in my life..." stories.
Been there.
Kevin: I've been there too, but I have less of them, thankfully, these days.
Need another cigarette? (I offer him my pack of Kools)
Kevin: I'm cool, actually. Hah, I didn't even mean it like that.
Alright. Favorite food in the world?
Kevin: Pizza from Bay Ride, Brooklyn where I grew up. It's a lot of Italian immigrants who settled out there. So, they've cornered the market on making, like, exquisite New York pizza.
Oh, those fold-em-in-half slices.
Kevin: Oh, sick. So good.
If you had to play one song, and it doesn't have to be one of your's, the rest of your life...what would it be?
Kevin: It would probably be a Bob Dylan song, an Elliot Smith song, or a Nirvana song. It depends on the mood I'm in. Do I have my band or am I by myself?
You can have your band.
Kevin: Well, for this tour, we'll do it that way...I would love to play "Serve the Servants". The first song on "In Utero", all the time. But, I think it's also just 'cause I just got a Fender Mustang and every Nirvana song sounds like Nirvana when you play it on a Fender Mustang. But, it would be that or...I love playing "Between the Bars" by Elliot Smith.
That's my favorite Elliot Smith song, and "Rose Parade".
Kevin: They're great. I love playing "Visions of Johanna" by Bob Dylan, too. I never play it because it's seven-and-a-half minutes long, and doesn't sound good unless you're him. But, that would be one that, if I was alone on a desert island somewhere, I would keep playing over and over again 'cause I could get good at it. Or try to get good at it anyway.
Do you remember the moment when you knew that this was what you wanted to do the rest of your life?
Kevin: I don't know that I even know that now. What I think is crazy is that I grew up in a middle-class family in Brooklyn. My dad was a cop, my mom's a nurse, and there was definitely not a history--there's creative people in my family, but not a history of people pursuing something artistic for a career. And if you're aware of my career-arc, it's not like I've had some geyser moment. It's not like I sell millions of records. It's very incremental how I've managed to build something, so I'm very aware of the fact that it could stop tomorrow. Especially with the economy, there's no guarantee. I mean, if you want to break it down to nuts and bolts: I make my living off how many kids buy a ticket to see a show, and then how many of those kids buy a t-shirt. That's a really tenuous way to make a living. There's no retirement plan. There's no health-coverage that comes with that. But, I really like what I do, and I make enough of a living to pay my rent, pay my bills, have money in the bank, and not have to have another job when I'm not doing it. And I realize that that's a pretty unbelievable situation compared to what a lot of other people's lives are like, and I don't want to short-change how crazy-lucky I am for that. But it's not like, "This is it!" I don't know, I don't want to do anything else. I can't remember...I studied Journalism and English. I've flirted briefly with maybe going to get a degree in education, and get even more in-debt with student loans. Or being a teacher, or pursuing journalism. I did those things lightly--I wrote free-lance journalism for awhile, and I still love to write. But, I liked doing that...I love this. I figure I'm not going to make money doing either, so...
May as well stick with what you love.
Kevin: Yeah. I don't know if that's a great long-term plan. It's not always the best decision in terms of your relationships or in terms of...it's weird, this worm has turned and now there's certain things I almost feel more comfortable with being away than being home. Certain things, which is weird, because you live at home. But, I spend two-hundred days a year not there. So, I've accustomed...
You've become more comfortable on the road.
Kevin: In some regards. Sometimes, I definitely have a moment where I'm like, "I wanna fuckin' go home." But, I love what I do and there's no...you're not promised anything. So the fact that I get to do something right now that I love so much; I'm just going to try to stick with that. There are definitely moments--when the Capitol thing happened I was like, "Wait, Capitol actually wants to put out my record? I guess I can actually say that I do this full-time." Because I didn't have to keep working at the office I was working at when that happened, or delivering vegan food in Brooklyn or temp-jobs.
You delivered vegan food?
Kevin: I worked at a vegan restaurant in Williamsburg. I'm not vegan. I was when I was younger, but I'm not now. But, yeh, there are definitely moments when you realize that you're...climbing, but I haven't had that thing that propels you through the roof. Which might be good, because maybe that's why my perspective is so present-minded. Maybe if I blew up when I was twenty-two I would think I'm supposed to be that big forever.
It keeps you modest anyway.
Kevin: Yeh, well, I don't see any reason not to be. We tour in a rented Toyota Sienna, so it's not like I'm rollin' around in a bus making millions of dollars a night. If I'm not modest I'm kind of being a horse's ass, because there's nothing to be immodest about.
Well, that's refreshing anyway. I've met a lot of bands that are very into themselves, rude towards other people, or listening to their own music like it's god's greatest gift. I like when musicians can stay polite, I suppose.
Kevin: Well, I think you kind of get infantalized when you're in a band. Your whole life is city to city, venue to venue. You can be pretty emotionally mature and be in a band 'till you're fifty. The trick is to try to do something you love, but also be a grown-ass man while you do it. That's the goal. I don't always get it, but I'm workin' on it. And, I like my own music, but I don't want to listen to it all the time. That's why I play it.
What would you say was your shining moment as an artist for you personally?
Kevin: I really love the record we just made. I don't know if that's necessarily for me to say, and that it's sort of up to other people. The only governing principle I have as a musician and a songwriter is an extension of what I'd like to be like as a person: I have to like it. If I love it, and no one else likes it--then at least I can look myself in the face. If I like it, and everyone else loves it--that's awesome. But, if I don't like it or believe it and other people think it's great...that's not rewarding to me. It feels creepy. Maybe if I was more like that, I'd be further ahead then I am or I'd have taken certain paths of less resistance than I have, but I like where we're at. I really do think the record is killer. I think the band is great. I think the songs are strong, and it's my favorite thing that we've worked on to this point. It's certainly the closest thing to the live-feel of our band, when I have a band. So, I'm proud of that. I'm really proud of that. I think a lot of people are going to be very surprised when they hear it, because I think it sounds like me, but it also sounds like...there's things happening that people might not expect. We'll say that for right now.
Alright. Lastly, what question do you really want to answer?
Kevin: Oh, uhm. Well, these are good, let me think.
Something you wish interviewers would ask you.
Kevin: I really loved working with Rob Schnapf--the guy that made "Put Your Ghost to Rest". He did all the Elliot Smith records, Beck's stuff, and he's done Guided by Voices, The Vines, and a ton of bands that I like. Some that I really love. He was the coolest guy I've ever met while doing music. We became close friends, and I wish the casual music listener was more aware of the role someone like Rob plays in making something. People tend to credit the artist and the band a lot. In hip-hop the producers seem to get a lot more credit. But, I know that guy, like...he taught me to sing, in a weird way. I always did this thing, I was very self-conscious about my voice so I shook it a lot. If I didn't hit the note and I wobbled around it, then it's like a style thing. But, if I just sung straight and didn't hit the note, well, then you'd know I couldn't sing. Part of it's nerves, I get really nervous when I play and some of it's stylistic and some of it was just anatomical. But, uhm, we went in to do this song "Go Haunt Someone Else" I went in to sing it, and he was like, "Oh, by the way, when you start...don't do that goat-boy thing." And I was really kind of like, "Fuck you. I don't do that." He was like, "Yeh, you do, and you can sing so don't do it." I didn't, and then he played it back and was like, "See, that's what you sound like if you don't do that." I was just, like, "Wow, alright." So, now it's been a conscious moving away from this insecurity. I could tell you fifty stories like that, just about my experience with that guy, but they wouldn't just be musical, they'd be personal as well. He's just one of the coolest guys I've ever met in my life. So, it'd be cool to be asked more about that kind of thing--the relationships you make with people like that. But, I don't think that's something a lot of people are aware of, so...other than that, I'm pretty okay with whatever someone's asking me. It's their interview, not mine. I'm there to answer the questions.
Do you still get nervous going on stage?
Kevin: All the time. All the time. Sometimes so much so that it's like you get sick to your stomach. But other times not as much. Some nights...a little. Some nights a lot.
How's tonight for you?
Kevin: I feel okay, but I'm feeling jittery. But I think it's because I haven't slept well the last few days and I'm drinking too much coffee. But, I'm good. I think tonight should be fine. I hoping that just for the sake of appearances that some more people show up. I'm okay with playing to seven people if that's who's there.
I'm happy with the turn-out. I mean, I want you to make you're money, but a small-crowd is nice and personal.
Kevin: Yeh, but I think it would nice. It's a pretty big room. Anyway, like I said I've studied journalism. If you've done your leg-work, then you generally write good interviews and they usually go well.
Well, I guess that's about it.
Kevin: Yeah, this was nice.
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